[RFC] How to approve user registrations when running a music market

Overview

This proposal is to draft how user approval should be done for the creation of a new market (music. μ-zomia) with current concerns.

Current issues

Initially, μ-zomia was planning to use soundcloud accounts for user authentication. However, some music-related people do not have soundcloud accounts (behind-the-scenes recording engineers, composers, conductors, etc., who do not have any output as music that can be viewed under their own names).

Even if we could get the above people in the background to create soundcloud accounts, it would be difficult to get an official batch. (It is assumed that they will not be able to upload songs under their own names, etc.)

Although it is possible to proceed with authentication using soundcloud accounts while ignoring the above, it is difficult to say that this is support for all people involved in music, and is considered to be against the open philosophy of Web 3.0.

This is not only a problem with soundcloud, but the same concern arises when trying to implement authorization for “public artist” accounts such as Spotify accounts and apple music accounts.

Alternatives and solutions

As an alternative/solution, I thought of using “Youtube account” for user authentication.

The reason is as follows.

  • It is easy to create a Youtube account (you can also authenticate with your phone number, so you can identify yourself).
  • It is possible to create an account for music related people other than artists.
  • When Proof of creation is introduced later, we can check the activity.

Consultation points and issues attached to the alternative proposal

  • Youtube accounts are already desired as “Youtuber market” by many people, so it is necessary to separate “music segment” among Youtube accounts (it is unclear whether this is technically possible)

  • No decision has been made within the Dev Protocol community to start talking about a Youtuber market.

My opinion

I would like to adopt Youtube accounts as the authentication method for μ-zomia, if it is technically possible to assign attributes to Youtube accounts later (music related, general Youtuber, science, etc.).

If this method can be realized, it can provide a means of account creation for many music-related workers.

As a result of our prior thinking about the launch of the music market, we thought that this was an issue related to the Youtuber market, which is a major market candidate later on. I would like to hear your opinions.

Regards,
μ-zomia
Kaoru Kimura

3 Likes

Since mu-zomia idea is to fund everyone involved in music, it totally makes sense to use YouTube instead. This has been discussed here on the forum a few times, YouTube is the most versatile platform, that’s why the community keeps asking for it. You could do anything and create contents about it on YouTube.

2 Likes

This would also be a good way to test the waters, prove that it is possible to tokenize YouTube creators directly, and make it easier for the future YouTube market to grow.

2 Likes

That’s right.

I think that doing the approval process on the Youtube account would provide a means for the “most music workers”.

2 Likes

Yes. I’ve been thinking about this too.

In any case, the Youtuber market is desired, and there’s probably no great reason to reject it.

But I don’t think we’ve gotten to the point where we’re discussing which Dapps or partners will lead that market.

Of course, I understand that the market and the approval method are 1:1 in the design philosophy, but if it is technically possible, Youtube accounts can have attributes, so that the approval method can be used for various markets.

1 Like

although youtube might seem like a good idea, it might devalue mu-zomia‘s value proposition.

Firstly differentiating between different content will be difficult.

second, youtube channels can have music and other random content, in a lot of cases it isn’t very consistent.

third, if a youtube alternative market is to be proposed. then most people will rather stake on the platform vs muzomia.

soundcloud is definitely a better platform to cater and stake to musicians. artists will without a doubt make a soundcloud account if there is the ability to get funding if that is your only concern.

2 Likes

Thanks for the comment.

Maybe you misunderstood me, so I’ll reply to you.

The point of my opinion is “which external account should be used to authenticate” so that music professionals (artists, people who are behind artists but work in music-related fields, people who don’t have works to output on soundcloud but work in music-related fields) can get staking whenever possible.

The challenge

In the case of soundcloud authentication, “artists” can of course create an account and get an official batch. However, we believe that sound engineers, recording engineers, and conductors, for example, would find it difficult to obtain an official Soundcloud batch.
(Soundcloud is that the certification is only for “artists,” not for music professionals.)

Alternatives and solutions

In order to clear the above issues, I thought about whether there is an account that can prove “my output” more widely, and I came up with Youtube account.

However, Youtube account contains various attributes.
So my suggestion is "If it is technically possible to add attributes to Youtube account (account A is music, account B is other), I want to use μ-zomia to authenticate Youtbe account.

I don’t want non-music related accounts to be registered in μ-zomia, so the point is to “give attributes to Youtube accounts”.

Later, when someone raises their hand and says “I want to create a platform for Youtubers!”, I think it is necessary to confirm whether “authentication with Youtube account” is only possible in 1:1 relationship with the market or in 1:n relationship.

3 Likes

I can see how YouTube would be preferable to SoundCloud if targeting a “broad music audience.”

However, as Cestfini mentions here, it would be difficult to restrict the YouTube Market to a specific category of creators. Also, even if you had a highly accurate filter for musicians, users might change their main focus to non-musical activities. If you replace YouTube with Twitter, this is the same, but it doesn’t happen with SoundCloud or Spotify, etc.

So if you want a YouTube Market, it needs to allow the Dev Protocol community to accept all (legitimate) creators on YouTube. In other words, the YouTube Market is open, and μ-zomia provides targeted use cases for musicians among them.

In this case, the Dev Protocol team does not have sufficient resources to filtered the YouTube users, so it would be preferable to have a council of several DAO members do the filtering. Perhaps the Council could be paid a fixed fee and would need to elect members regularly.

I would also like to add that we should implement Proof of Creations, and any filtering flow should be removed, which would be ideal for me.

5 Likes

Prerequisite: Stakes.social currently has an onboarding process with screening to avoid bad actors, and μ-somia will also follow that process. This means that technically it uses a YouTube market, but Dapp is targeted only for music creators. And μ-somia team needs to have an operation that excludes non-music creators.

The important issue that we are facing is the regulation of the market.

This is not only problem of YouTube market, the same problem will happen on SoundCloud market. For example a Dapp specialized for DJs/Voice actors using SoundCloud authentication. For this reason, a market cannot be occupied by a single Dapp.

So, we need to think about

  • Should similar markets be created for each Dapp? (SoundCloud for A and SoundCloud’ for B)
  • Or should many Dapps be able to use a same market?

I want to hear from technical perspective from @akira_taniguchi @aggre :thought_balloon:

3 Likes

I think that this is ideal.

I think that it is even better that two Dapps occupy the same market. It’ll giver Stakers/fans the option to choose which is the best for them to use to support their favorite artist. It helps to improve the ecosystem imo.

1 Like

I have one concern that has come to mind about the challenge which you have, not about market regulation.

The challenge

In the case of soundcloud authentication, “artists” can of course create an account and get an official batch. However, we believe that sound engineers, recording engineers, and conductors, for example, would find it difficult to obtain an official Soundcloud batch.
(Soundcloud is that the certification is only for “artists,” not for music professionals.)

May I ask the following questions?

  • If all music professionals could register as users of μ-zomia, what kind of users do you think would attract staking? Are they artists, sound engineers, recording engineers, or conductors?

  • What would be the ideal conditions for the music professionals?

    • All music professionals equally to issue social tokens and each to collect staking.
    • A representative artist collects the staking and distributes the social tokens or rewards to the music professionals involved.
    • or other

I would like to understand what users expects for μ-zomia.

3 Likes

I’ve thought of two ideas about the issue.

[Once KYC, permission-less authentication]: Creators confirm their safeness and pledge to CoC through decentralized KYC. Markets do not involve any screening process, and naturally, permeating a concept that one Market and one authentication target.

[Chaotic environment, curated Markets]: Multiple Markets have different or exactly the same onboarding process. There is governance filtering, but in essence, they continue to increase unorganized. Dev Protocol DAO sets an example for secure Markets by managing a Curated List of Markets. Creators can use any Market, but in most cases, they will trust the curation list.


In my opinion, the Market should be unique to what it authenticate. As a premise, the subject of authentication is an entity that an oracle can mechanically identify. For example, music such as EDM and jazz is uploaded to SoundCloud, but SoundCloud users do not have metadata such as EDM and jazz. Therefore, the selection of EDM musicians and jazz musicians always requires manual screening, which allows for innumerable Markets with different screening difficulty levels. It is also my concern that the lifespan of Markets is determined by the person responsible for the screening process. I believe we should abolish the screening process is motivated by the desire to keep all markets decentralized and consistent. To achieve this, I believe that the solution called [Once KYC, permission-less authentication] is effective. Still, I like the approach [Chaotic environment, curated Markets] of allowing buggy markets, end-of-life markets, etc., to generate metabolism and optimize with repeated upgrades.

Below is a completely personal idea:

  • Implement YouTube Market as a centralized market screened by μ-zomia.
  • The YouTube Market may or may not abolish the screening process in the future. It depends entirely on μ-zomia.
  • Dev Protocol DAO creates a Curated Markets List.
  • When creating the Markets list, if the YouTube Market is limited to music, it will be mapped as a Market for musicians. When an open YouTube Market emerges, markets with limited uses may be excluded from the Markets list. But even if the YouTube Market is excluded from the Markets list, μ-zomia has no loss.
  • In the long run, a decentralized KYC approach [Once KYC, permission-less authentication] may also be implemented, with the two concepts running side by side.
2 Likes

Thank you for your question about an important point.

In μ-zomia, “All music professionals equally to issue social tokens and each to collect staking”.

We believe that the above is the world that needs to be realized.

Even if it is possible to distribute rewards from a representative, we believe that the “music professionals’ accounts” should be on μ-zomia.

Currently, we are aware that there are many needs for the music market as a whole, such as

  • Staking of the music itself (distribution of copyrights and royalties to the rights holders)
  • Staking for artists (where NFTs and premium content are provided as compensation)

At the moment, μ-zomia is close to the latter type, and the scope of staking is broader than the “existing concept” (which targets only artists).

2 Likes

Great idea, thank you.

I would like to ask for some more explanation.

  • " When creating the Markets list, if the YouTube Market is limited to music, it will be mapped as a Market for musicians. When an open YouTube Market emerges, markets with limited uses may be excluded from the Markets list. But even if the YouTube Market is excluded from the Markets list, μ-zomia has no loss."

The second half of the above is about “But even if the YouTube Market is excluded from the Markets list, μ-zomia has no loss.”

In this case, is the concept that μ-zomia is connected to the open Youtube Market, and that μ-zomia authenticates each account individually (μ-zomia verifies that the account applied for is a music segment)?

1 Like

Thanks for the answer!
It is definitely new standard for all music artists and professionals :slight_smile:

I hope the world that artists who earn creator rewards and will stake the portion of rewards to professionals when they feel thanks to team! Everyone in the μ-zomia all grow the music ecosystem. :dove:

2 Likes

I’m glad you said that!

I also appreciate mayu-san and aggre-san’s sincere efforts in this matter.

It’s a difficult point, but we’ll figure it out together!

1 Like

I think the basic idea of ​​a Curated Market List is to show “less restrictive”, “safer” Markets. In my opinion.

So if an unknown YouTube Market that isn’t restricted to music categories is developed in the future, I think it’s better than the YouTube Market that is restricted to music categories, and deserves to update the Curated Market List.

In essence, and in technically, since μ-zomia can handle assets that are authenticated in any Market, it shouldn’t be a big issue which Market the user is authenticating as long as the asset points to a musician. And since Market differences have no effect on μ-zomia’s profitability, you can or may not integrate with the open YouTube Market instead of the market created by μ-zomia.

3 Likes

Thank you for your reply.

I understand about aggre’s idea.

Now, after this reply, I would like to proceed again to authenticate with Youtube account in μ-zomia.
※ It is not that I want to monopolize the Youtube market, it is just to reduce the limit of subscribers (so that many music people can subscribe to μ-zomia).

2 Likes

Great discussion!

I think that you’re doing the opposite here. Which is creating a free market, if another youtube market dapp shows up in the future, individuals who want to support musicians on YouTube, will have at least 2 options of dapps to do that which is great!

3 Likes

You will!

I think each platform will be unique!

3 Likes